Choosing my next bike.... Agony

[Stusmoke]

Hai everyone!

My dilema here is what bike to choose (duh). First off any cc I mention here is a 2 stroke. I will never touch another 4 stroke motorcycle for as long as I live (MAYBE an older XR).
So I've been told by countless people that the 125 is insane fun. To me a dirt bike has to try very hard to not be lots of fun but I've been told that the 125 is an absolute gem to scream out. Not to mention it would have a great learning curve for a first time stroker like me! HOWEVER this machine, while obviously sounds like the way to go, has the significant draw back of the rings waring a little too fast for my liking. Having said that while I hear of people doing 50+ hours on their rings I've also heard of people that make it a point to whack new ones in every 10-20. I'm eager to learn more about mechanics as well and rings aren't exactly expensive (unlike valves) so Its not a MAJOR concern but my first question here is the TRUTH!! I will be riding the machine fairly hard but will start out soft as this is my first ride on a 2 stroke and I want to know ROUGHLY how many hours I can expect to get out of the rings. Im not a perfectionist, I really do doubt that a bike can go through rings that fast with MY RIDING STANDARD. So as I said, for a decent rider that rides hard but will start out slow and never absolutely thrash it how often can I expect to NEED to change rings. I emphasize NEED!

Second bike I had lined up was a 1999 250 EXC. This one obviously has PLENTY of squirt and I will no doubt have an absolute ball on it not to mention its rings will probably last decently longer as will most other engine parts. My main concern here is the learning curve. I've only ever ridden a four stroke and as such will have to drastically readapt my riding style for the screamer. Will it work? Will I be able to learn easily without killing myself? I'm anticipating this machine to be quite the handful and probably isn't the best to learn on but I'm only buying one bike.

So guys, what am I better off with? The 125 for the fun screaming with the downside of the rings/pistons issue? Or the 250 EXC with more power (who doesn't want that?) and a steeper learning curve but presumably longer engine life? Also I should add I can get the 250 EXC cheaper then the 125. This is also a huge bonus

Thanks for your time guys I appreciate it. Remember the NEED part... I don't need a machine that will deliver the utmost highest compression possible I just need a bike to belt around on a makeshift track.

[eprovenzano]

If you plan to MX, the EXC will have softer suspenion, as it is designed as a woods / enduro bike.  I have an EXC and love it, but I am not an MX'er.  I'm much happier banging my bars off of trees.  While I have not had any problems on an MX track, I can say that on the larger jumps the suspension is too soft for a serious MX'er...  which I am not..   

I see you are concerned about redoing the rings.  Yes a 125 needs rings sooner than a 250, but don't let that bother you.  Its easy, and inexpensive.  Back in the day, we used to change rings in between races. I know of several 125's that have been on the same piston / rings for several years.  If you are not an "A" rider the piston / rings are not an issue.  If you get the 125 you should start a riding season with a fresh top end (piston / rings, wrist pin needle nearing) and change rings mid season.  On the 250 I'd start the season the same way, but skip the rings and rebuild until the off season.  As you get used to the bike, you will begin to see signs that is time to freshen up the top end.  It will be a little down on power, it may start to smoke a little more, but most of all based on the compression tester, you will know when its time.

No matter which bike you choose, 125 / 250, get the one in the best condition you can afford.  As with all used bikes, some money will beed to be spent to fix, freshen up a few things.  You may need some new tires, grips, wheel bearings, etc...  Factor that into your purchase as well.

Good luck, and I'm looking forward to seeing you on a smoker.

[twosmoke595]

well im just going to say that ive put at least 25 hours on my 125 (bought used, i have never touched the motor except oil changes and air filter) and there's no telling how many hours was put on the engine before i got it. Now i'm a fairly fast C rider, i'm not saying i wring it out all the time but i do spend my fair share on the pipe. I recently bought a new top end for it, not because its running bad but purely as a precaution. one of my buddies has a 03 cr125 that he bought brand new. and he's on the original top end. All he's done is oil changes. Still runs really strong, but then again he's not the fastest guy out there. I think the exc will probably be to soft for its intended use. They're great woods bikes like previously stated but for anything more than doing small jumps at a track, you're gonna beat the bike up as well as it does you. For your first smoker experience i'd recommend a 125, the 250 is a great bike, but even a woods 2 stroke is still a handful compared to your average 4 stroke race bike. a 125 would teach you good technique and you'll really get teh feel of what its like to really ride a 2 stroke fast on that thing, especially with some seat time.

[cnrcpla]

The whole 125 or 250 choice is up to you. Yes a 250 would last longer ring wise than a 125. My 250 has gone a while with the same rings. But honestly, doing a top end job on a two stroke will cost you about $200 at the most, and you can do it yourself. All you have to do is take the cylinder off, and the rest is pretty self explanatory. Not to mention with everyone on this forum, I'm sure  you can get some kind of step by step instructions and help.

[MetalMike1982]

I rode my rm125 for 2 years without touching the topend and no telling how long the previous owner rode it . I started to notice the compression was feeling a little low so I put in a new piston , rings,wrist pin , wristpin bearing and circlips , top end gasket kit and it cost me $93 .  As long as you run 32 to 1 with a good quality 2t oil and stick with it you will get plenty of time out of it  before it needs rings .

[burn1986]

I've never changed just rings on a 125. I raced one for about 3 months straight, before doing anything to the top end other than cleaning the power valve.

Depending on your budget, why not go for a KTM 150? 

[metal_miracle]

doing 10 hour riding a week  this summer... i would have had to change piston often.
so i change when the power and compression feel lower


using 32:1....  and  warming up the bike whitout reving and doing 1 round slow on the track
seem to work


I used forged piston in the bike that went 2 years of riding on it, 85cc  i think that piston is still in that bike....

and used cast on another 85cc, bike that i could feel less power at 30hours i am sure it could have done 50 on that.

[chump6784]

My mate sold his crf 250 and bought an 05 ktm 300 exc, he loves the exc in a paddock but on the track it is heavier an not as agile, plus the suspension is too soft. I wouldn't worry too much about changing rings, its easy and cheap and 10 to 20 hours is a guide. How hard you ride will depend on your maintenance schedule. As said above, do them half way through the season and then full rebuild for the next. You will feel when they need to be changed, the bike will kick over really easy and lose a little power

I love 125's and I wouldn't let changing the rings scare me off getting one

[Stusmoke]

Hmmm... It's definitely sounding like the 125 to me. If its not risking the rest of the engine just for not doing the rings really often I'd much prefer to have it. Learning on the 250 doesn't sound good at all I mean I'm sure I could do it but as you've all said the 125 will make it much better. What year model for the 125 should I look for?
@burn1986 I've looked so very hard for an older 150/125 SX within my budget (about $3,000) and driving distance but to no avail Very sad indeed
I will be running the good stuff in terms of oil theres no doubt about it. Although considering the controversy about which oil is indeed the best what is everyones opinion on this matter?
Thanks heaps guys!

[chump6784]

as far as oil goes i currently run silkolene cos that is what my local shop sells and i ran it for years when i raced with no problems until i got sponsored by motorex and ran that. motorex is good stuff too and i have never heard anyone complain about motul either and i know suzuki recommend motul oils.

one oil i would stay away from is rock oil. before we got motorex for free we got rock oil. we switched from silkolene to rock oil and after a couple of blow ups started paying for silkolene again. there was also another guy i raced with that gave rock oil back and paid for another brand. that was the late 90's so who know if its better but i wouldnt go near it

[rookie]

i used to riding 125 for past 10years

now riding a 150sx, the fun factor went up!

 

[Stusmoke]

Rock oil you say? I've never even heard of it. I have one very good rule that I stick to in terms of brand names: If I haven't heard of them, I don't buy from them. And I'm here to tell its worked extremely well so far! Maybe the Rock oil is specific to certain countries? I don't know if you're in Australia or not. Having said that I am relatively out of touch with the brand name world and could just be fumbling in ignorance.
I've currently got http://www.bikesales.com.au/all-bikes/private/details.aspx?Cr=0&R=12020670&trecs=2&PriceTo=682&__sid=1352436F3EFD&__Ns=p_IsPoa_Int32|0||p_RankSort_Int32|1||p_HasPhotos_Int32|1||p_Make_String|0||p_Model_String|0||p_YearMade_Int32|1||p_PriceSort_Decimal|1||p_PhotoCount_Int32|1&__Qpb=1&__Nne=15&seot=1&__N=1432%20604%201430%201429%201626%201428%204294967209%204294967207%20682%2079&silo=1400   Lined up. Although it does seem a little too cheap... I've sent him an email asking if he can provide some sort of proof for the recent top end. @burn1986 Lol talk about Irony right?
Thanks guys

[MetalMike1982]

Rock oil you say? I've never even heard of it. I have one very good rule that I stick to in terms of brand names: If I haven't heard of them, I don't buy from them. And I'm here to tell its worked extremely well so far! Maybe the Rock oil is specific to certain countries? I don't know if you're in Australia or not. Having said that I am relatively out of touch with the brand name world and could just be fumbling in ignorance.
I've currently got http://www.bikesales.com.au/all-bikes/private/details.aspx?Cr=0&R=12020670&trecs=2&PriceTo=682&__sid=1352436F3EFD&__Ns=p_IsPoa_Int32|0||p_RankSort_Int32|1||p_HasPhotos_Int32|1||p_Make_String|0||p_Model_String|0||p_YearMade_Int32|1||p_PriceSort_Decimal|1||p_PhotoCount_Int32|1&__Qpb=1&__Nne=15&seot=1&__N=1432%20604%201430%201429%201626%201428%204294967209%204294967207%20682%2079&silo=1400   Lined up. Although it does seem a little too cheap... I've sent him an email asking if he can provide some sort of proof for the recent top end. @burn1986 Lol talk about Irony right?
Thanks guys

That seems kinda pricey compared to what bikes are going for in my area but it does look like a nice bike .  A buddy of mine just picked up the same bike a few months ago in 10 out of 10 shape for $1800

[Stusmoke]

Theres a HUGE and I mean HUUUUGE markup for almost everything in Australia. For a brand new CRF450R you're looking at 12 grand if you're lucky. Its about 30% markup compared to the states. Damn I wish I only had to pay that much...

[chump6784]

that is a pretty god price for a bike that seems in good condition. the older model ktms were not as popular as the jap bikes, could be a reason it is a bit cheaper or he just wants to get rid of it quick. from what i have heard it took ktm until about 09 before they were on par with jap bikes as far as chassis and suspension goes. this one having the suspension properly done might be just as good though. would definitely check it out anyway.

i went looking at new bikes today but there were no 250sx's in stock. apparently they sell well and are hard to come by. lucky 2 strokes are dead and no one wants them cos then they would be impossible to get. end sarcasm